Sunday, June 26, 2016

Jehovism Deconstructed



WHY THIS ARTICLE?

            This article is dedicated to the untiring efforts of Shri Rajiv Malhotra, a dharmic warrior par-excellence, who has been shining light on the various issues plaguing Sanatana Dharma.  For decades, he has lamented, despite great following, few do more than watch the bull fight from the popcorn stands. I refuse to participate in the heart ache of this intellectual giant, hence this squirrel’s contribution to the Sethu bandana, of raising the awareness of Hindus. I begin with a clarion call to all dharmis to get onto the arena as players and not merely be spectators.

PURPOSE

            In the tradition of PurvaPaksha, we try to understand other traditions and logically, theologically and intelligently challenge the loopholes in their theory. The intention of the article is not to dwell on the inconsistencies within the bible, gross inaccuracies despite a massive bibilical archeology push or to expose the uncharitable acts of the missionaries or proselytizers, since the invention of that religion. For the latter, one can read more in Breaking India – Rajiv Malhotra.

            An UttarPaksha is given, highlighting the inaccuracies and logical flaws in the theology of Christianity. A large overlap exists with Judaism. Hence, both are included as Jehovism, who is the Father in the Heaven for Christianity. 

The article aims at educating Hindus and arming them with facts which should help them in combating the ever-growing evangelical and proselytizing attempters in India. The article will not disrespect any of the traditions, however illogical and wrong they are. Reading these type of articles should aid Emotional Kshatriyas(EK) to become into Intellectual Kshatriyas(IK). IKs must take such information and put it into action.

So far, we have seen only pathiris (Church Father) and proselytizers do campaign calling all of us sinners. We need to turn the table around based on clear understanding of their theology. For a quick easy version, I recommend reading the Hindu Good News.

PurvaPaksha – Quintessence of Christianity

            There is only one God. God Exists as Trinity, who are three, yet one – Father, Son and Holy Ghost. Father is also referred as Jehovah, son as Jesus and Christ and Holy Ghost as Holy Spirit. God is the one created this world from nothing (The Christian interpretation of the world as flat and created six thousand years ago, is now increasingly morphed as God created the Universe to be in line with modern science). This beginningless God wished to create, so he made angels and the Heaven. Some of them (a third) disobeyed and were sent to Hell. God took six days to create the world and then took rest on the seventh day, Sunday, also observed as Sabbath.

            God created the first man, Adam in his image. He created it from dust and breathed life through the nostrils and placed a soul in him. He then took a rib and made the first lady, Eve. He let them into the Garden of Eden to enjoy and forbade them to eat the fruit of the forbidden tree. Satan, the fallen angel, Lucifer, took a form of a talking snake and enticed Eve to eat the fruit. She partook and also convinced Adam to follow suit. Jehovah discovered this lapse and cursed them and all their future unborn progeny (a bunch of curses). This is the original sin and all humans are born with it. It gets transmitted to next generation, irrespective of the human behavior. 

            Souls are put in this world per God’s will. Souls are by nature born into sin and are naturally attracted to it. God sent many prophets to steer mankind. After 4000 odd years, God took pity and the Holy Ghost descended into Mary’s womb to be born as Jesus Christ. This virgin birth was necessary for God to help mankind get over the original sin. After a series of trials and tribulations, Jesus Christ gives up his life. He gets crucified on a cross and dies as a sacrifice for all sins of mankind, stemming from the original sin. He then comes back to life and ascends to Heaven to occupy the right side of Jehovah.

            All souls are given free will (This doctrine appears to be a later construct more as an explanation to the questions posed, not literally found in the bible). Salvation can be had ONLY by liberating from the Original Sin and all the following ones. This can be ONLY had by having faith in the Son, Jesus Christ, the Savior. As the world comes to an end, Jesus Christ will appear in all his glory to make Judgement. He will call all those who are alive and bring back the dead to their physical bodies. The good ones line up on his right and the bad ones to his left. Faith in Christ is the primary merit which determines which side one lands up (so by this logic, even Buddha and Gandhi are destined to Hell). Upon judging their merit, the good are sent to heaven to enjoy for eternity. The evil ones are sent to eternal hell, consigned to raging fire.

            Souls who attain salvation are free of sins, live in heaven, praising God, enhancing his glory and experience God forever.   

UttarPaksha

            This segment is focused on taking each of the core Christian idea and proving it as an air castle. Demolishing any one is sufficient to disprove their tenets. Yet, we will see how multiple ideas can be demolished and prove that their entire theology is an artificial construct.

Original Sin – Its creation and propagation is the only sin

            There are quite a few interpretations given by Christians to circumvent the flaws, including asserting that science is not correct to creation story is an allegory. All of them showcase the hollowness of the core ideas. No idea is more central and essential than the idea of Original Sin in Christianity. Yet even a school child with decent logic can knock off the legs on which this entire religion stands.

            To counter this, the tools deployed by the church include increased fear based on hell and Satan, dealing severe punishments (luckily in the modern world we do not have burning women as witches on stakes, they seem to be exclusive to radical Islam).

            Hearing the footsteps of Jehovah, Adam and Eve, overpowered by shame and the idea of nakedness, an idea given to them by the fruit of wisdom they partook, try to hide themselves from him. Jehovah looks around and calls out, “Where are you?”.  If Jehovah was Omniscient, how come he has to wonder what happened and where they were hiding? Should he not be aware even before hand?

            Jehovah had already witnessed a rebellion of angels. He should have at least been aware of Satan’s motives from his track record.  He failed to read Satan’s mind again or could he not read him at all in the first place. In either case, he is not Omniscient. If Jehovah was absent when Satan tempted Eve as a talking snake, He definitely is not Omnipresent. In case, he knew, but failed to stop Satan, he is definitely not omnipotent.

            Let us give the benefit of doubt and assume Jehovah knew it all and still let it happen, fully aware of the consequences, and then he is definitely demonstrably not displaying compassion. Which Father will let their own children to be subject to such a terrible condition, knowing well that the children may not be able to handle and still be declaring oneself to be called as compassionate? Even animal parents do much better as we see in the world.

            To top this compassionate claim, Jehovah places a series of curses on Adam and Eve and entire humanity.  How can entire mankind be made to pay a price for the mistake of one couple, far removed in space and time? If on the other hand, it is argued, these were part of his plan to increase his glory, which again seems to be a vain display, who is interested in showcasing the glory? Before humanity, only he existed, so what a bloated ego to create entire humanity and universe, just to have a bunch of robots singing paeans.

            If we continue to argue that Jehovah created the entire universe, per his own plan and design, then it also follows that the original sin was predetermined and premeditated. In such a case, how can one accept that the original sin stems from Adam and Eve, it must definitely be from Jehovah. If at all anyone deserves the punishment, it must he Jehovah himself as he is culpable of putting entire humanity’s fate on the hands of one couple who were not made aware of Satan at that point or even the protection of the Omnipresent creator.

            Not only is this original sin doomed to exist till Armageddon or Doomsday, but also passes on from parent to child like a genetic disease or a venereal one. Thus even a newborn, just out of the womb, can be ridiculously be called a sinner. What sin would a new born commit? Yet the compassionate Father in heaven declares it so. 

Satan and Hell – One hell of a hole in their theology

            Satan and Hell are at the core of Christianity, one can even say on par with Jehovah. If such an idea doesn’t exist, then any logical mind will start seeing all the holes in the theology. To hide these, they manufacture fear and fuse all the holes into one and label it as Satan and banish him, along with the ones who question, to hell.

            Christianity deems the universe as black or white. If you do not accept any interpretation, however ridiculous it may be, as it is, then you must be inspired by Satan and destined for Hell. They pushed the very thought oriented Greeks and Romans into a medieval dark age. Till Renaissance happened due to the contact of ideas flowing from elsewhere, they held complete sway on the masses with a vice like iron grip. Even today, in bible belt school districts of the southern US, evolution theory is not even taught to school kids.

            One is constantly being reminded how cunning Satan is. Yet God is busy watching? The alternate solution offered is blind belief and demands that reasoning be kept away. 

            Logic demands that God created a perfect world (later interpreted as universe, as the Christian logic could see only a flat world with stars flung for decoration in the sky). Even before he created his best creation man, he had witnessed a rebellion from a third of the angels. So doesn’t it amount to an imperfection? Instead of fixing the root problem, Satan, he lets him persist and toy with his more precious creation, Adam and Eve. Was he not aware or powerless against Satan? One really wonders with the constant ways Satan is being described of his powers, if he is more powerful than even Jehovah?

            The Hell presents deep problems to Jehovistic ideology. It is one hell of a problem, which Jehovists will never be able to climb out of. It is declared that after Judgement Day, all non-believers, who are all sinners by default, get sent to hell to be roasted in hell fire for eternity. So who is running the Hell kitchen fires – God or Satan? If Satan, why is God still tolerating Satan, but not the poor mankind who are far inferior to Satan. If Satan, is it part of a deal with him that God will send poor souls for fueling the fire? If it is God, why is he so cruel and sadistic to those who merely didn’t believe in his glory? Why is Jehovah such a bloated hubris? That too the punishment is for eternity. So by their book, Mahatma Gandhi and even Buddha and all Jain Tirthankars will be busy roasting in Hell. What an idiotic, imbecile way to look at the Universe.

            The Hell problems fester at the core of Christianity. Let us assume someone borderline case, realizes as soon as he is about to be pushed into Hell. One cannot rule out such a theoretical statistical possibility. If such an individual, incessantly repents and prays from Hell, will they attain Salvation? If the answer is Yes, then stay in Hell is not eternal for such a person. It also means there is a potential backdoor from Hell. If the answer is No, then the fact that Jehovah and Christ are not compassionate is evident beyond any doubt. It also disproves their marketing ploy, “Faith will bring Salvation” is as big lie as their religion itself.

            We already saw that how all sins get trumped by the biggest one of all, disbelief and there is only one punishment – hell fire roast for eternity. On the flip side, in heaven, will the enjoyment be proportionate to the deeds performed by the individual? Or is faith the only entry point and qualifier for all enjoyments. If so, one can safely conclude, Jehovah has no sense of justice, since he displays no sense of proportion in either heaven or hell. This defeats the very claim Jehovah is a just God. If the answer is no, there are gradations in heaven and hell, it opens up more serious issues. Do the enjoyments get adjusted for the sins performed? If that is so, then why not the ones roasting in hell, get their punishments in accordance to the merits they have performed? 

            In either case, Jehovah is caught between heaven and hell, which seem to be equally problematic for the ideology.

            Hell’s problems do not stop there for Jehovah. Where does Hell exist? If Hell exists inside God, within his domains, then part of God is Hell, which is untenable to Christians as God cannot be impure. If that be the case, Hell exists outside God. This definitely proves that God’s presence or access is not there everywhere. This negates the basic idea God is all pervading.  So either they must accept hellish attributes exist in God or they must accept that their God is not Omnipresent, which obviously implies, he is not omniscient and omnipotent.

            We can thus logically conclude that Jehovism is riddled with more holes than all of Hell they describe.

Exclusivity – a tale of Hare’s horn

            Throughout the existence of the monotheistic desert religions of Judaism, Christianity and Islam, they have insisted on exclusivity. Only certain individuals and certain tribes were favored by God, not only to receive information, but also qualify as the chosen ones. None of them venture to qualify what sets them apart.

            Old Testament, which deals with the exclusivity of the Israelite tribes, fails to get in line with science. Why were other civilizations much older than the biblical ones not chosen by God for the message? This also explains why the 19th century indologists like Max Mueller, Robert Caldwell were desperate to tie the vedic period to just prior to Christ. The minute Saraswati valley sites started popping up, they kept this artificial barrier by repeatedly propagating the lie that the Vedic period was after the Harappan times. No one was allowed to venture and ask what if the Vedic period could have been contemporary to the Saraswati valley civilization or even predate it, per the oral traditions of India.

            We have thus seen the effects of exclusivity that keeps introducing strong prejudice even in seemingly unrelated academics.

            The Christian ideology took this further and reserved the exclusivity around the individual – Jesus Christ. Till date there are no proven historical documents or records from the contemporary period of Christ. Though there are ample proofs unearthed for many Old Testament events. We can for the time being ignore the fact that the Gospels were written several decades after the supposed historical figure Christ. We may also ignore the severe internal inconsistencies commencing from his birth to death. We can also try overlooking the fact that most of what is the framework of modern Christianity did not emerge three hundred years later through the Nicene Creed.

            Why did Jehovah try the various attempts to instruct mankind (read only Israelites) end up as failure? God could have made Eve conceive Christ instead of Mary and cured the mankind of this grave Original Sin. Didn’t he get the idea till he experimented with various prophets from Moses to Abraham? If one were to say he tried his best, but humanity with free will kept going back to sin, then we must acknowledge that Jehovah’s plans were not foolproof. Why didn’t he consider all the aspects before coming with the plan? Was he not aware? Again dents his claim as Omniscient.

            He kept following this Israelite tribe like a shadow, yet the so called compassionate God didn’t choose to give his ideas to the other major civilizations that existed like Indus Valley, Chinese, Mesopotamian and Egyptian. We can at least overlook the rest of humanity were not as advanced. 

            It appears this exclusive deal doesn’t conclude with Old Testament. The New Testament and Christ’s exclusivity can be best summed in Michael Arnheim’s words – “And yet there is no religion in the world which is more insistent than Christianity upon its claim to truth or more confident of its superiority to all the other faiths”.

            Once any logical person gets exposed to Sanatana Dharma and gets an idea of the different paths that lead to realization, one is compelled to be charitable to entertain the notion that there must be more than blind faith as the path. Ekam sat, vipraha bahuda vadanti thunders the Vedas. 

            This lack of charitable feeling based on an elevated understanding compounded the by the evangelical zeal is at the root of many evils mankind is facing today. Rajiv Malhotra has repeatedly explained the mess behind this history centric approach to Truth, which makes one arrogant to call other religions as demon inspired or worshippers of demons. We already saw how shallow the demon centered arguments of Jehovism lacks legs.

Virgin Birth Conundrum

            It is contended that Mary and Joseph were betrothed. Yet Jesus Christ was born without any contact from her man or other. To save Mary’s life (as death by stoning was the prevailing tribal method to deal with out of wed lock), Joseph has Mary to move in with her. They do have other kids after Jesus. So how does it negate that Mary did not conceive from either Jospeh or another man. This proves that Joseph and Mary were neither ascetics nor thinking beyond the flesh.

            In Christian theory, every child inherits the Original Sin. If that’s true both the mother and the father should have to have been above the Original Sin. Mary is born under normal circumstances and hence a sinner. How come Jesus did not inherit the sin, because only the male parent is the Holy Ghost? So arguing that the child born from one sinner gets the sin absolved due to the contact with Godhood is circular.

            If we contend the Holy Ghost was the only reason behind Jesus Christ’s birth, then where was the need for Mary? If Mary was also a required cause, then how come the sins do not contaminate the special child?  Again we go back to special case exclusivity. If the Holy Ghost could protect Jesus Christ from the sins, in that mechanism, why didn’t God have so much compassion to protect the sins from getting passed along like a venereal disease? Again points to lack of compassion. 

            The usual cop out given by the faithful is God’s ways are mysterious. Anything we cannot explain or when they get cornered, God is indeed mysterious. Of course, humanity does not have all the answers in Nature, nor will it ever in future. Yet, if one were to merely accept the exclusivity argument, one can safely conclude it contradicts the compassionate nature of God.

            So either the idea of virgin birth, which existed in many surrounding cultures at that time, has to be accepted as a myth or it must be given the same status to all the cultures that believe in virgin birth as a possibility.  If we agree that all virgin births are true, it kills the exclusivity idea of Christianity. If on the other hand, if we continue to insist only Jesus Christ as a progeny of virgin birth, then it is pure myth. Obviously all the theology and ideology based the myth crumbles to dust.

            Science is adding more to the acceleration of killing this virgin birth myth, which is why many conservationists do not want any research on these lines. Many animal examples are documented beyond doubt to give birth in an asexual way, called Parthenogenesis. Many include invertebrates, few vertebrates like amphibians and reptiles. In humans, already stem cells have been produced from unfertilized eggs through parthenogenesis. Once science proves a fully viable embryo can be produced from a woman, it will permanently exorcise the exclusivity arguments which are critical and central to Christianity.

Resurrection

            The Christian doctrine recently has been amplifying the idea of Trinity – Father, Son and Holy Ghost is all the same entity. If they are all the same, then it is obvious Jesus could have never died. If he never died, then he was not immortal. If he died, it means that even God is mortal. This paradox is being avoided by the explanation that Jesus was not the body - Oops are they finally accepting the Hindu philosophy that you are not the body. Please put shutters on the shop or accept you are stealing from Hinduism. 

            If Jesus was not the body that died, then why make the big deal of the sacrifice as anyway he was the soul.  The sacrifice appears meaningless if one were to focus on any soul only is important argument. Isn’t death in other humans the same event where we sacrifice the body, albeit not per our choice? Even in Christ’s case it was not his preferred choice. He keeps lamenting to the Father why he had to undergo all these. He did not keep reiterating the church’s claim which should have kept him at peace knowing well that it is part of the Sacrifice for mankind plan.

            If Christ was continuously aware of his being GOD and going through the motions, emotions and commotions in the body, then the entire Resurrection episode as narrated in the bible, stands on a quicksand. God completely aware of the body and soul idea (sounds like Vedanta) goes through this exercise of sacrifice where he sheds the body. So what does that sacrifice amount to? How did it pay for the sins, because someone vicariously suffered for you? Then what happens to the people who were born prior to Christ, who never heard of Christ, like Buddha for instance.  At least Moses, Abraham and the Israelites have had special chance. What about the various great souls like Confucius, Lao Tzu prior to Christ in civilizations far away? If they get the same grace of Christ then why not others in other periods who do not believe in him?

            Resurrection is such a critical event in biblical history, yet the four authors give different account on the time that lapsed between Christ’s placement in the tomb and when he emerged. Also the number of people who first saw varies completely that it cannot be even treated as a testimonial. Even if one were to give varying accounts of the number of hare horn spotted and the place they saw, hare's horn is still a fantasy.

Sin

            Sin is a very central idea, essential to the very existence of Christianity. If the world needs to follow this idea, unless one is psychologically brainwashed to condemning oneself as a sinner, one may not feel the necessity for redemption. A detailed comparison on the idea of Sin can be found in the article – Are you a Sinner?
 
            Christianity’s core idea that Jesus Christ died for all the sins of humanity begs some serious questions. It is argued that God wanted all the people to know of this sacrifice, hence their underlying missionary zeal. If so, how many have died before Christ’s birth and how many in future will be born without ever hearing Christ’s name or deeds? So God was very unkind to all those who never came in contact. Since it was the wish of the Father and clearly this wish has not come to pass, so it was either an ill-conceived plan or a special one to keep many unfortunates away. If it is argued that the ones who were born, who never heard of him are given special privilege, then it is against their tenet that one must have faith to get salvation?

            Hell is the permanent residence for all sinners. Since Jesus Christ takes all the sins, does he get sent to Hell? No comes the response as he was faithful to his Father. So what happens to the fruits of action, Karmaphala? We already saw in the earlier sections that there is injustice in the way Jehovah operates.

            Since all the karmaphala are coming after the Judgement Day, why do we see so many evils and sadness all around? Why are so many babies afflicted with fatal genetic diseases? Pat comes the response, God created them with a special purpose. If the argument is they are sent to the world to give a message, it still does not justify the suffering why as individuals they undergo. Hence suffering has become another central idea. Any amount of probing give us only the circular logic, God’s ways are mysterious, we, humans, are too puny of an intellect for us to understand the ways of the Lord.

            Christianity has always kept the Doomsday at an arm’s length. Not a generation, in its history, has passed without the fear of an upcoming Doomsday. This enables them to keep their masses within the circle of fear and a constant reminder that the Judgement Day is around the corner.  Over the two millennia since Christ, when devout Christians, in their millions are eagerly awaiting the Judgement Day? Where are they waiting? What is the status of their souls? Are they in heaven or hell, what do they experience? If it is in accordance to their future heaven or hell tickets, then why have Judgement again? If not, why get punished while waiting?

            How come the judge (God) can be impartial, if he knew at the time of creation what a soul is going to do? Increasingly it is being argued that God gave free will and the individual soul is empowered to make its own choice. Then it implies that God does not know of this choice before hand, reopening the argument that Jehovah does not seem to know everything. One cannot have both the extreme ends of opposite choices. One may not be able to contend that God destined a few at their inception to a doomed future and still argue that the soul has the free will choice. Perhaps the Christians may start stealing probability theories next, they need to begin applying Hiesenberg’s Uncertainity Principle in their theology, and the mere thought of science coming to rescue the ideology is enough to make the hardcore Bible believers cringe.

            Now let us analyze from another viewpoint. Jehovah sent his son to die for all the sinners. Bible argues it took four thousand years of human history for Jehovah to figure the right solution. Why did Jehovah let so much time lapse between Adam and Christ? Again, one of those unexplainable, mysterious ways of the Lord is the best response one can hope for.  The ones who literally go by the book will rush to his defense that Jehovah was not quiet, sent us so many prophets to help this specially chosen tribe. So all those prophets prior to Christ were not effective prototypes? Or they were still part of the plan. If argued they were not designed to be ineffective, what was the plan with all the prophets to get them out of the Original Sin? If the argument is Jehovah did a step by step approach to eradicate sins, it again goes back to their famed hopeless escape, mysterious are God’s ways and we are too small to understand the argument. The same small brain only has so far broken down all the available logic given by the blind followers of the blind faith.

            The argument is God first let the world to be plagued by Satan, continues to let him trouble poor humanity and then redeem it, sounds more like an evil plot right off the pages of Hollywood.  Jehovah has premeditated this entire scheme as he is ready to send the dissenters by creating Hell. If his plan was to rescue all, then why was there a need to create Hell. We already looked at the holy Hell mess.

            If sins, were already removed by Jesus Christ, all believers should have instantly attained salvation. But all souls are supposed to wait for the Judgement Day, which follows the Doomsday is still around the corner. A little more wait for these souls may serve them better as they are promised an eternity in heaven.  It is argued that children who die very young will also attain salvation. This is due to the grace of God we are informed.  If that is true, why not provide the same grace to other non-believers who might have never come in contact with even the word Jesus Christ?

Snapshot since Creation – The mess really begins here

            Man was created in the image of God. Is God with or without a form? If without, how come man has one. If the image stands for the soul, then there is a more interesting knot. God created man from dust, in his image and breathed life. As God’s breath was already pre-existing, creation is nothing more than a rearrangement. So only the body was created and not the soul, as it literally is God’s breath. (We will not bother asking what God is breathing and if that is a prerequisite for his existence).

            God created this entire world of diversity. Science has shown the timeline, per bible, not only to be absurd and ridiculous but also untenable. Let us assume that only the timing was wrong, then why does such an incredible diversity exist, in far corners where mankind has not even reached like sea trench. Again mysterious are the Lord’s ways that he created those creatures for singing his glory in the depths of the ocean.

            Why only a specific desert community was chosen amongst others, again mysterious are his ways is the only response. If God gives both happiness and sorrow, what is the criterion, without repeating the default response? There seems to be grave injustice at the root of such an explanation, not glory.

            Interestingly God existed before creation for eternity. The suddenly one day he decides to create a universe of automatons who will be singing his glory. Knowing pretty well, some of the folks will not follow his plan, as he could not design them properly in the first place, he creates Hell for those dissenters. He did not learn from his first rebellion, which proves his limited powers, a far cry from being Omniscient, Omnipotent and Omnipresent. His prophet series did not really solve the Original Sin. So he comes with a very innovative sacrifice of merely the body, which was perishable to start with and calls it a sacrifice for all mankind.

            From the repeated claims that the Son was sired by the Holy Ghost, it proves that the Son was non-existent prior to this event. Yet it is claimed that both the Son and Father are the same and equal, which is untenable.

Conclusion

            With this small walk through, we have completely deconstructed Jehovism. It is my sincere endeavor that more innocent Hindus are protected with this information. We have completely, logically demolished all the strong points of Jehovism. But, we are not out of the woods. If one were to read Breaking India - Rajiv Malhotra, one can easily understand the long powerful hands that are holding the Indian society.

            Let me again end this article with a call for all Sanatana Dharmis to unite and understand the road ahead. Let us spread the awareness of the flaws in the Jehovist ideology. Let us understand our responsibilities. Dharmo rakshati rakshitaha. We have a responsibility to protect Sanatana Dharma and in turn that Dharma will protect us.

Om Tat Sat

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69 comments:

  1. Thank you for this detailed statement. It clearly states many points that I believe merit thorough examination from a broadly inclusive or interreligious perspective. I am a western follower of a kind of universal perspective on religion that has been highly informed by the great voices of Hinduism -- including Vivekananda (I have his collected works), Yogananda (he is a constant influential presence in my life), and the broad Hindu doctrine of Brahman/Atman as I am able to understand it. From my western perspective -- and in the context of the excellent remarks offered by Rajiv Malhotra during International Yoga day -- I believe we should also pursue a kind of broad reconciliation of of east and west, in this same spirit of uniting to protect and expand the truth of the Sanatana Dharma everywhere. With much appreciation, from Santa Barbara CA USA.

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    Replies
    1. Thank you Bruce for your kind thoughts. As a person who can understand Hindu philosophy, you will find the rest of the articles on this blog equally interesting. Please take some time to peruse. I appreciate your feelings towards Sanatana Dharma, the protection and explanation of which is the main purpose of this blog. I will be writing about this so called western(materialistic) and eastern (spiritual) POVs. This is exemplified in the story of Virochana and Indra from Chaandogya Upanishad. I will be writing about it shortly.

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    2. A) Bruce is typical GOOD COP and potentially a person who will digest ideas of Hinduism. Later he will be a classical U Turner.

      He resembles a pseudo intellectual Phil Goldberg who tried to appropriate Vedas into bible and sought to glorify the non-existent jesus.

      My bet is that Mr Schuman is salesman par excellence of manure and fertiliser and in the process also purveys or should I say peddles the "sameness myth".

      So my contention is this:

      1.) According to the Gold standard "Nicene creed", *all* are born sinners.

      2.) This therefore facilitates the *myth* of virgin birth (if it is not a myth, please replicate the same and let child less couples go through this technology instead of IVF). So jc was born without having sex, so that he could save the entire humanity....see point 3 below.

      3.) So jc now does substitutional atonement for all these bloody sinners.

      Now if the above is false let me know ( any decent christian will not dare)


      Now this is what Hindus do:

      1.) They are born divine!!! No BS about original sin!!!
      2.) Hence no need for substitutional atonement.


      So these are two different ideologies and I owe all this to Shree Rajiv Malhotra and his seminal body of work BEING DIFFERENT.

      B.) With regards to ekam sat.....this is the typical refuge of a scoundrel from abrahamic perspectives. What ekam sat implies is for
      Dharmic traditions. Please see this:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jrl7HaV3f6Y


      C.) Coming to final aspect: Mr Schuman ....I introduce you the concept of Mutual respect as opposed to tolerance that swines in the abrhamic world give us. I don't want tolerance which implies that abrahamic do us a favour by tolerating us. I hope your wife tolerates you or better still you tolerate her. How about both of you have a situation where you have mutual respect?

      Here is something to enlighten you ....


      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rajiv-malhotra/hypocrisy-of-tolerance_b_792239.html?ir=Australia

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rajiv-malhotra/dharma-and-the-new-pope_b_2755683.html?ir=Australia

      So Schuman the starting point for you and your lot will be to get the Pope to give Mutual respect otherwise everything else is as bogus as you.

      By a Friend - Prabhat Gupta

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    3. Prabhatji, nice points. But you need to observe the twist here. Since all these flaws are inherent in Christianity(Traditional), hence the new motivation to absorb Vedas into it and rebrand it as Reviatalized Christianity or may be even Universalism.

      My question is why even ponder about merging Vedas with incompatible Christianity to do CPR on a theologically dead idea.

      This has exposed the intentions and it is even more dangerous than it appears. The deep pockets lined with such ideas are a deadly combination. We need more IKs to spread this message.

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  2. Appreciate the quick reply. I will certainly look at the rest of this blog, and want to print out this particular article for some careful study. I share your strong conviction that "default" Christian theology merits a very strong critique, and that the profound universal ideas of the Sanatana Dharma shed some very helpful light on these questions. I don't know if I could call myself an Advaita Vedantist -- but I am highly influenced by those ideas. Let me get this article printed, and I might have some further comments. With appreciation....

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  3. Wow.... great article... many things are explained very logically and clearly...

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    1. Thanks Seren. Now the task ahead is to spread the message around.

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  4. Thanks for a fantastic Uttra Paksha on Jehovism. It will be great if some hard core Christians can responds with reason and logic to this demolition of their cult beliefs. Jehovism is based on simple blind faith. Apart from their default logic( a great term you have coined for this "God works in mysterious ways", kudos) I cannot ever see Christians coming out with any viable opposing point of view. Thanks once again.

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    1. Thanks rk. Now this logic can be refined every time we pick an argument with a proselytizer or conversion gang or the ever increasing converts who are deployed to attack Hinduism.

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  5. Satchitanandji, pranaam. I appreciate the fact that somebody is taking on the gauntlet. There are only a few points that I wanted to raise. Some of the criticism, especially, from the point of view of materialiastic senses can be equally applied to the Hindu Bhakti tradition. God is omnipotent and omniscient and can act as the exact opposite of that as well. That is, He makes the rules and He can break His rules as well. So the criticism of Christian theology that something doesn't seem logical can be explained away by His desire to perform lila. Even in our Puranas we have examples of the sin of father visited upon or being taken upon by the sons. And the Vaishnava philosophy does say that whoever has taken birth has sinned in the past otherwise there is no reason for an atman to fall down to mrityuloka. Similarly, immaculate conception, etc. can be explained away by His omnipotence.

    As you can tell the nature of the tree from its fruits, so I think we can tell the nature of Christianity from its effects on the world. Otherwise, it's very hard for our material senses to differentiate between true/false religions.

    The biggest problem with Christian theology is its treatment of time. It fails in expecting the truly humungous time scale of the material world which is evident to our eyes and reason. It also condemns some souls to hell in eternity, which is not consistent with a merciful God who is the father of everyone.

    More importantly, unlike Vaishnava Bhakti tradition, it propels people towards material enjoyment. A Vaishnava saint would be considered mad and impractical and the Church has killed off many such saints among its own.

    The important test is, as someone's devotion to Christ increases (say the Pope), do they become more materialistic or less? The whole point of religion is to gradually lead people away from materialism. In that Chrisianity has failed therefore it can't be considered a religion from the Hindu point of view.

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    1. Appreciate your detailed post Anand. The bigger challenge in front of us is the massive amount of time many many christian schools and missionaries spend digesting our philosophies into christianity. I am not talking of the church kodimaram or the saffron dress being copied.

      The easiset to usurp from Vedanta is Vaishnavism. Technically many places started calling themselves as Body of Christ. This is direct offtake from Vaishnavism, especially Visishadvaita, where there is a philosophy of Anga-Angi. For Paramatma, Jivatma is akin to body.

      Another example, just type Prajapati and see you will find more christian articles than even Hindu. They have written so much in the last few decades and literally taken over Prajapati as Father in Heaven.

      I think it is high time we start countering these articles, ideas stolen and showcase them that these are not mere cultural ideas being stolen, but core ideas stolen by Christianity to survive.

      The declining church numbers in the west, coupled by huge boatloads of money they have make Hindus very vulnerable targets as most of us have divorced from core Hindu values.

      My request to people with such detailed analytical ability like you is to either material like this and improvise it by talking to converts and/or help spread awareness of this open trend of conversion by any means.

      We have a big responsibility to protect Sanatana Dharma handed to us over millennia.

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  6. Thanks for all of this. It's exciting to see the vitality of this conversation. It's a pleasure to be in the company of people who are both scholars and believers.

    As a western universalist with a scientific disposition, I'd like to see this conjunction of east and west mediated with a high degree of diplomacy and "co-creation". I can readily understand and appreciate the detailed list of issues reviewed on this page by Satchitananda, and also in this side-by-side comparison on the "Being Different" Wikipedia page:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Being_Different#Divergence_5:_Translatability_vs._Sanskrit

    I might want to approach this critique by understanding the kind of traditional Christianity critiqued here as a kind of "outer plane" (rather than transcendental) religion, inherently insensitive to broader notions of unity and any idea of Brahman/Atman congruence. From this point of view, I might want to then consider notions of "sin" in terms of an ignorance of the ideas of reincarnation and karma. A lot can be explained -- if not justified -- in those terms.

    I'd like to see the emergence of a revitalized Christianity, where the deep mystic insights of the Vedas are fitted in to a notion of "Logos" and "Christ" -- perhaps in the form of "One Body".

    This idea might seem facile or trivial -- perhaps the kind of "western universalism" that the Being Different book is intended to critique.

    But if we want to see the emergence of a truly universal and global spirit of Oneness in the world -- entirely consistent with the Sanatana Dharma but not "owned" by anyone -- I think we could then be in resonance with the vision of Vivekananda.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logos

    And for me, the notion of "One" called for by Plotinus

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plotinus#One

    can be understood as identical to the "One" defined in the Rig Veda:

    "Ekam sat vipra bahuda vadanti - "that which exists is One: sages call it by various names."

    http://adishakti.org/_/ekam_sat_vipra_bahudha_vadanti_that_which_exists_is_one.htm

    Thank you



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    1. Sorry Jehovism peddled under any brand name doesnt hold a candle to the sunlight of Vedas. Why should Vedic knowledge be filtered through whatever flavor of Christianity. Absolutely not acceptable.

      First tell clearly what is left in Christianity after all their core ideas have been demolished. If at all there is a need, there is one to elevate oneself and get connected with the source, not more theories. Why not follow vedas instead of trying to imbibe it and recast a broken model which is beaten hollow.

      There are lots of Indian Gurus who are under this maya(delusion).

      First let Abrahamism learn MUTUAL RESPECT for all ideas. It is only at paper level and the maximum I have seen is, we tolerate these backward Hindu ideas approach.

      There is no need to revive Christianity infused with Vedic ideas. They are totally incompatible with Christianity and will only accelerate its death. No matter how much one tries to digest, severe indigestion will only remain.

      If Christianity wants to learn Vedic understanding, let them call it Vedas.. why mumbo jumbo of Universalism or some new name. Vedas means Knowledge and they will remain in my book as VEDAS only, not revitalized Christianity. To me, it is immaterial if Christianity is revitalized, metamorphosed or wants to digest. Sanatana Dharma is Santana Dharma.

      The minute one gets charitable that more than one path exists, that itself means the current Christianity flavor is dead, so they will never accept subtler truths. So as a truth seeker if one is learning Vedic understanding, why the hesitation to call Vedas.. why separate branding is needed?

      So why desperately try to marry Vedas with Christianity? I know they have been busy stealing ideas. Just search the word Prajapati, how many articles are Hindu and how many are stolen Christian idea to recast Prajapati as Father in heaven.

      So this Sarva Dharma Sama Bhava can happen only on a level platform. There are lots of forces which will not let that happen.

      Your feedback only has strengthened my understanding of the environment we operate.

      And the last point on Vedic quote - I can see where that article is coming from. Merely reiterating the idea of hijacked Prajapati.

      Misinterpreting vedas will not take one to knowledge. I see this stealing ideas from Hinduism is the last desperate attempt for Christianity to survive. They have been doing it with lots of Vaishnavism ideas.

      I can assure you one thing, no matter what they try to swallow, since it is not organic with their ideas, as christianity is only an amalgam of many; vedic ideas will not let Christianity survive. If not me, many like me will come and poke holes at the transcendental or revitalized or borrowed or stolen christianity also. I care less if Christ died or my sins are being suffered vicariously for every person has to be a Dheera on the path of Spirituality, after all my sins. OK, if Adam and Eve want to outsource their sins, no problem, I will carry it for them also.

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  7. Sorry to hear that. I doubt that Shiva or Krishna are enraged with Paramahansa Yogananda. http://www.yogananda-srf.org/lineageandleadership/Lineage_and_Leadership.aspx

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    1. It's not a question of getting enraged, Bruce. There are many people in the past, who have made an attempt to understand and synthesize the reflections of truth in Christainity with the Vedic relgion. I'm afraid it hasn't been very successful precisely because the Christian ego has only used it to borrow ideas yet has stuck to its beliefs of universalism and continued merrily on its expansionist project with no change in its outlook on other religions.
      A worthy question to meditate upon would be whether Christianity hasn't turned into the proverbial Lincoln's Axe. And can we still call the axe Christianity? If yes, then what is the animating spirit behind it that keeps on borrowing yet not becoming humbled enough to stop claiming unversalism for its creed?
      According to Hinduism, religion is not a collaborative project created in consulation with various truth claims to arrive at one true Universalism. Religion is truth, it already exists, and when one is fortunate enough to find it, they should accept it humbly, not try to repackage it under their own label to claim materialistic glory for their narrow groups (or to prevent glory to go to something outside their groups).
      In matters of religions, Hinduism teaches not borrowing, but learning at the feet of gurus. And then honoring their gurus to the point of self-effacement. This is the only way to advance spiritually. Even God in His incarnations, accepts a guru and pays them uncritical respect.

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    2. Very nice points, Anand.

      @Bruce - perhaps this may be a wrong forum to wonder about the rage of Shiva or Krishna.

      Just to set the records straight. Yogananda and his hijacked western legacy is well known. First of Yogananda didnot come under the worship of Vedantic ideas. Secondly Christianity totally absorbed and tried to repackage the deal back to India like Christ and Krishna are same, see Yogananada. All these marketing ploys are well exposed.

      Please do not show SRF picture as proof. That is the most desperate one. Prove me in Yogananada's original writings where he told Krishna is his lineage. Adding Christ and Krishna was definitely to market it back to India. Prove me if Yukeswar or their prior gurus wrote exclusively on this lineage.

      I do not want to deliberate on those ideas here.

      Let us stick to

      a) Poke holes in the article's logic - I can atleast improve.

      b) Did the Holy Ghost give up the Ghost in the face of logic, eastern ideas? - Continuation of the same a).

      c) As already noted with your resuscitating CPR on Christianity infused with Vedas, is another desperate attempt to repaint this broken model with borrowed ideas, so that Hinduism can be eventually stamped out. - This will help me expose more loopholes in Jehovism

      d) Why should Jehovism desperately survive if it has to borrow Vedas for its own survival? - Again continuation of c)

      I will definitely write later proving that all Gods are not the same, definitely not the monotheistic desert religions concept and the dharmic ideas.

      Let this article discussion be centered around the theme.

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    3. Thanks for the responses. Yesterday, I did find what seemed to be an accurate if brief statement of the Sanatana Dharma, as defined by Encyclopedia Britannica. I think I can honestly say that this brief sketch describes what I am doing, or attempting to do.

      https://www.britannica.com/topic/sanatana-dharma

      "The term has also more recently been used by Hindu leaders, reformers, and nationalists to refer to Hinduism as a unified world religion. Sanatana dharma has thus become a synonym for the “eternal” truth and teachings of Hinduism, the latter conceived of as not only transcendent of history and unchanging but also as indivisible and ultimately nonsectarian."

      As a westerner and a practitioner -- I say -- if you authentically follow those simple guidelines, you are an authentic practitioner of the Sanatana Dharma.

      Secondly, I do have Vivekananda's "What Religion Is" book here -- along with his collected works and several books about him, plus a number of books published by the Vedanta Society, founded by him.

      My understanding of Rajiv Malhotra is that he a defender and advocate of the vision and mission brought to the west by Vivekananda. The Wikipedia page for the Malhotra book Indra's Net states:

      Indra's Net: Defending Hinduism's Philosophical Unity is a 2014 book by Rajiv Malhotra, an Indian-American author, philanthropist and public speaker, published by HarperCollins. The book is an appeal against the thesis of neo-Hinduism and a defense of Vivekananda's view of Yoga and Vedanta. The book argues for a unity, coherence, and continuity of the Yogic and Vedantic traditions of Hinduism and Hindu philosophy.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indra%27s_Net_(book)

      The great mission of Vivekananda was to bring the Vedantic vision to the west. I would say he was wonderfully successful, and he changed the course of history.

      The opening words of Vivekananda's book "What Religion Is" are as follows:

      "We see that the apparent contradictions and perplexities in every religion mark but different stages of growth. The end of all religions is the realizing of God in the soul. That is the one
      universal religion.

      "Through the vistas of the past the voice of the centuries is coming down to us: the voice of the sages of the Himalayas and the recluses of the forest; the voice that came to the Semitic races; the voice that spoke through Buddha and other spiritual giants. This voice is like the little rivulets that come from the mountains. Now they disappear, and now they appear again in stronger flow till finally they unite in one mighty majestic flood. The messages that are coming down to us from the prophets and holy men and women of all sects and nations are joining their forces and speaking to us with the trumpet voice of the past. And the first message it brings us is: 'Peace be unto you and to all religions.' It is not a message of antagonism, but of one united religion.

      "At the beginning of this century [the nineteenth century] it was almost feared that religion was at an end. Under the tremendous sledge-hammer blows of scientific research old superstitions were crumbling away like masses of porcelain. Those to whom religion meant only a bundle of creeds and meaningless ceremonials were at their wits' end. For a time it seemed inevitable that the surging tide of agnosticism and materialism would sweep all before it. Many thought the case hopeless and the cause of religion lost once and for ever. But the tide has turned and to the rescue has come-what? The study of comparative religions. By the study of different religions we find that in essence they are one."

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    4. Again Bruce, Thanks for taking time to discuss in detail. I humbly believe that we are debating an altogether different topic, one that is not related to Jehovism. We can always artificially connect even more topics.

      I think you will have to wait for either an appropriate post. I definitely would love to pick it up there.

      I want to focus in this article and discussion only ideas why Jehovism is right or wrong. We need not have to bring Vedanta into the mix, worse still imitating vedanta and trying to rebrand it as revitalized christianity. I am sure I have left out many of the finer aspects of Christianity which demand a proper rebuttal. I request you to dig those and would love to debate on them.

      Look forward to discuss more in line with the article's theme.

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    5. Bruce is "good cop" wanting to peddle jesus bullshit here. I doubt whether he and hisss Prasanth are connected?

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  8. • My dear Bruce Schuman, let me also join the conversation. We all here are intellectually enlightened persons and understand each other who stands where. Perhaps you would agree with me that the first and foremost requirement on our part is ‘honesty’: honesty to admit what is what. In the article under comments, the issue is ‘illogical stands of Christian faith’ as we find them existing today and being propagated. Therefore, one will have to deal the first thing first. We cannot bring in here ‘Sanata Dharma’, which is an altogether a different though-system. When we discuss the subject matter of this write-up of Satchidanand, we confine ourselves to the subject matter. And, then the questions of ‘tolerance’, ‘mutual respect’, ‘universalism or satyam ekam vipra bahuda vadandi etc.’ would arise. First, please, accept that Christianity is UNCOMPATIBLE with Sanatana Dharma in their respective core concepts. If one is right, the other would be wrong ipso facto. Let me recapitulate these mutually contradictory core concepts. The first: Christianity holds ‘Soul’ is born sinner (Sanatana Dharma – ‘Soul’ is born Divine). Second: C holds for salvation from this sinful state, it is necessary and enough that one embraces Jesus Christ (SD – ‘Soul’ is covered by the worldly influences of ‘Maya’ and one has to better this pitiful state by one’s ‘Karmas’ and embracing ‘someone – like Jesus Christ’ – cannot help at all. Third: C holds after one’s death, he or she has to lie in grave till the Day of Judgment, when he or she will be assigned ‘Hell or Heaven (SD - holds this “Soul’ takes birth again and again in multiple lives (even starting from insects to humans) to get “Mukti, Nirvana, Kaivalya’ etc., which C terms salvation. There is no such thing as Judgment Day). Four: C holds that ‘Father’ created this world (later on substituted with ‘universe’ to make it accord with science) in six days, with Adam, Eve, Eden Garden, with (forbidden) fruit etc. etc. (SD holds that entire existence is undergoing cyclic evolution, emanating from ONE force – Brahma – and geared to submerge in this ONE force again and again). These core concepts are only a few by way of an example, which in C and SD cannot hold together. Now, the issue comes of ‘tolerance’ versus ‘mutual respect’. It is a paradoxical situation before a person when faced to deal with C and SD. One has to reject either of the two to be true to himself or herself. Where do you stand, dear Bruce?

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    1. Nice points Shreepalji. Glad to hear more clear articulations.

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  9. Dear Brother Satchitananda,

    May GOD bless you and your family. Appreciate your interest to study the Bible. Can you please explain me the meaning of "Jehovah"?

    Thanks in advance

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    1. I am not an expert in Hebrew. But based on my understanding, the old Testament is filled with words JHVH and YHVH. The words are intentional as Judaism felt that God is beyond words and his name cannot be taken by humans. So the name was kept without vowels.

      Jehovah and Yahweh, which are found through out Old Testament are usually translated as Lord or God. These two words have also been extensively used as a compound word, when used with words like Jireh,Rapha, Nissi.

      In New Testament, the word Father in Heaven is the most common replacement.

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    2. I will also like to add, it really doesnt make any difference if Jehovah means something glorious or if it means Qanna meaning Jealous.. Yeah OT calls their God Jealous, what you need to focus is what is spelled in my name SAT-CHIT-ANANDA.

      We have already beaten their philosophy hollow on all counts, we need not have to propitiate some irrational ideology whose only claim is better believe what is said or else you will be roasted in hell for eternity.

      Let us stick to ideological debates not semantics. Let us debate if Jehovism can even respond to the points raised, instead of trying to revitalize Christianity idea floated earlier or trying to point how great Jehovah means or how he can strike terror.

      Sanatana Dharma is not enamored by ideas of Swarga or naraka. The idea of life, per Sanatana Dharma is to constantly work on the Purusharthas, the goals of life in different angles. MOKSHA IS DEFINITELY NOT SALVATION OF JEHOVISM.

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    3. Dear Brother Satchitananda,

      May GOD bless you and your family. Thanks for the reply. First of all, I would like to clarify one thing to you. I am not here to debate with you. In a debate one tries to defeat others. In that process, we may use logic, illogic, exchange some words, mock each other, build hatred, anger.... etc. But all these are abomination to GOD. GOD wants us to love each other.

      After reading your post, I had an impression that you know lot about the Bible but you missed essence of the Bible. If salt loses its saltiness, it is of no use. I will definitely discuss each and every point that are raised by you in the article and share my little knowledge with you. But it won’t happen in a single day. If you really want to know answers for your questions, kindly have some patience and bear with me. I believe that unless and until we understand basics, we cannot understand greater things. That is the reason I started with a basic question asking the meaning of “Jehovah” which was also the title of your article.

      Let me explain you about sacred name of GOD. It is composed from four Hebrew letters YOD-HEY-VAV-HEY, יהוה
      Transliterated as YHVH or YHWH. Added vowels and pronounced as YaHoVaH. Later in English it was pronounced as Jehovah.
      In Hebrew HaYaH (היה) means "WAS" (past), HoVeH (הוה) means "IS" (present), Yi'YeH (יהיה) means "WILL BE" (future).
      The sacred name of GOD is a compounded word formed by combining above mentioned three words. Thus, it gives the meaning "He was, He is and He will be". I hope you agree with me that GOD was there in the past, GOD is in present and GOD will be in future (If you agree that there is a GOD).

      Yes, Bible explicitly says that GOD is a jealous GOD. Again, I emphasis that if we don’t try to understand the scriptures with deep insights, we will not get the actual point. Why do you think that GOD cannot be a jealous GOD? I don’t know what is your view about GOD. But I believe that GOD can have a relationship with man, He can love us, He can listen to our prayers (hear), He can answer to our prayers (speak), He can care us, He can protect us, He can strengthen us, He can sanctify us, He can heal us, He can provide in our needs, He can discipline us and of course He can be a jealous GOD. It may sound like a weird character for you unless you understand it. Jealousy is of two types: sinful jealousy and sanctified jealousy. Sinful jealousy means painfully coveting another’s advantages. This sinful jealousy is an act of the sinful nature and Bible condemns it. However, sanctified jealousy is something like a proper response of a husband or wife whose trust has been violated through infidelity. Indeed, when an exclusive covenant relationship is dishonored, sanctified jealousy is the passionate zeal that fights to restore that holy union. If we can clearly understand the meaning of the word jealous, then we don’t have any problem to say that GOD is a jealous GOD.

      In your article, you said that Christian interpretation of the world is flat. I assume that you are referring to earth. Please let me know what is the difference between world and earth and why do you think that Bible teaches a flat earth?

      Thanks in advance

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    4. Namaste Prasanth ji

      Can you please let me when will God feel jealous and how is it justified?

      Dhanyawaad

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    5. @ Prashanth - Yes debating is a tradition in India, where one can logically take to a higher plane. Dry logic is not accepted. I can understand why the desert religions are afraid to debate and say anything about God, if outside their book is blasphemy. I can understand your desperation not to roast in hell fire.

      Comedy of all times, GOD wants to love each other. I wonder if you ever read anything in history. Forget Crusades, forget dark ages, do you even know how the new world and africa were treated. Forget all that.

      DO you even know to what level they stoop to copy hinduism to desperately increase headcount. So obviously when challenged, they will either duck and run or do ad hominems.

      http://jagrukbharat.com/6337/christian-inculturation-hinduism-religious-prostitution-b-r-haran/

      Religious prostitutes, stealing ideas to prove some weird logic which they are not even willing to discuss.

      I also thought people who want to discuss will have some fundamental logic. If salt loses saltiness.. classic idea stealing. Anyways, I deliberately try not to introduce ideas like the practitioner's disgraceful acts over the last two millennia.

      So you defined Jehovah. What does it prove?

      If God is jealous, it basically implies, he doesnt have something and someone else has it. Basically it implies that God is deficient in something. This clearly proves that God per your own defintion cannot be omnipotent, as he already displayed lacks.

      This desperate semantic brainwashing, especially after reading hindu scriptures is really amusing. More non Hindus are seriously reading Hindu scriptures than Hindus which is a sad fact.

      Dear Prashantji, you said you are not here to debate, but I have a feeling you either want to merely parrot unrelated points or to quiz me - both are futile.

      You have not yet refuted one single point, but dancing all over. What a tragedy, you want to keep repeating the same glory glory but will go on mute when asked about the gory gory things done.

      Hope you will stop being Alex Trebek or Siddharth Basu and try to respond to the questions raised. I have my limitations, just like Jehovah defined.

      Forget the flat earth, there are still people in US who believe the earth was created 6000 years ago and Satan buried the fossils to make it look like that. If that is the desperation of Satan obsessed God and its followers, what can one expect.

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    6. crypto christian Prasanth is trying very hard like the jorno crypto christian Mihir Sharma.

      What would really benefit these lecherous lot is if they read:

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rajiv-malhotra/hypocrisy-of-tolerance_b_792239.html?ir=Australia

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rajiv-malhotra/dharma-and-the-new-pope_b_2755683.html?ir=Australia

      A simple look at the history will tell you the expansionism of xian is pretty much like mullahs. They appropriate
      the vedas, the upanishads etc and claim it as it is theirs. Actually one does not have to go far: Look at their names
      they have stolen Hindu / Sanatani names and then claim scholarship!!! It will do good if you changed your name
      to Bill Clinton / George Bush etc ...at least it would look somewhat real.
      by a friend - Prabhat Gupta

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    7. Dear Brother Ranjith,

      May GOD bless you and your family. Thanks for asking the question.

      This is a most common question. “The Jealous God? The Bible clearly states that God is a jealous God. In fact, it even says that His name is Jealous. Isn't jealousy a bad thing? Does this make God the divine hypocrite?”

      The Bible makes it clear that GOD is not like humans in that He never commits sins, but is absolutely Holy. However, English translations of the Hebrew scriptures say that GOD is jealous. Both the Old Testament and New Testament say that jealousy is a bad thing. In fact, jealousy is listed as one of the sins. So, if GOD is jealous and jealousy is a sin, then God must be the divine hypocrite.

      Jealousy is often thought of as being a negative trait. So, many people think that the Bible's description of GOD as jealous means that He must be a divine hypocrite. The main reason why many people think that GOD should not be jealous is that, as an English word, "jealousy" has virtually universal negative connotations. In the original languages in which the Bible is written, Hebrew and Greek, the words translated as "jealousy" in English do not always have negative connotations. In fact, the Greek word often translated "jealous" is zēlos, from which we get the English word "zealous," referring more to zeal and ardor rather than jealousy.

      Let me tell you about three Hebrew words:

      קָנָא – Transliteration: qanah, Phonetic Spelling: kaw-naw'. This word appears 32 times in Hebrew Bible.

      קִנְאָה – Transliteration: qinah, Phonetic Spelling: kin-aw'. This word appears 44 times in Hebrew Bible.

      קַנָּא – Transliteration: qanna, Phonetic Spelling: kan-naw'. This word appears 6 times in Hebrew Bible.

      The inability of the English to accurately reflect the original Hebrew language has created the problem. If we look at these three words, the spelling is different, the pronunciation is different and of course the meaning and context is different. If we fail to understand the differences of these three words, then obviously we draw wrong conclusions. English Bible gave the word “Jealousy” as a translation for all the three words. Now one question should raise in our mind that, if they have same meaning, why would Hebrews use three different words? Simple answer is that they are not same.

      The doctrine that GOD is a jealous GOD comes from the Old Testament books of the law of Moses. The "jealousy of GOD" is always in the context of idol worship. All verses in the Bible where the word kan-naw' (קַנָּא) appears are – Exodus 20:5, Exodus 34:14 (two times in this verse), Deuteronomy 4:24, Deuteronomy 5:9, Deuteronomy 6:15. What these five verses have in common is that they all share the same Hebrew adjective, kan-naw' (קַנָּא), translated with the English word "jealous." The interesting thing about this word is that it is only used in reference to GOD. In no instance is the word kan-naw' קַנָּא used to describe human jealousy. The reason that GOD is "jealous" is because He wants people to choose to love Him. YeShUA said that the most important commandment was to love GOD. GOD does not want us to waste out time worshipping pretend gods that do not exist. (My intention is not to hurt anybody’s sentiments. Since Bible speaks about monotheism, I hope you are prepared to hear about the concept of One GOD. I don’t even argue that my GOD is the only true GOD, you are absolutely free to choose. My intention is to say that, no matter what is the name of GOD, but if at all we agree that there is one GOD, then it implies that no other god exist).

      (To be contd)

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    8. @Ranjith (Contd)

      Whereas GOD's "jealousy" is primarily restricted to a jealousy over the worship of idols that competes with His love to prevent a dedicated relationship with Him, jealousy between people takes on quite a number of forms. Two different Hebrew words are used to describe human jealousy. The Hebrew verb kaw-naw' (קָנָא) refers to a passionate jealousy or envy. The Hebrew noun kin-aw' (קִנְאָה) takes on a wide range of meanings from sexual passion (or jealousy) to a zeal for God to anger or envy. The exact meaning is usually determined from the context.

      The differences between the words describing human vs. godly jealousy are profound. GOD does not envy a human being or anything that any human being possesses. God has no rivals. The apostle Paul indicates that there is a godly form of jealousy.

      The point I want to make is that in the original languages in which the Bible is written, the words do not have those negative definitions. Since the word used to describe the jealousy of GOD is not even the same word used to describe human jealousy, it is clear that the apparent contradiction is just a result of an inability of the translated language (English) to accurately reflect the original language (Hebrew). There is no slight on the character of GOD in the original language.

      Now you may ask me another question that if GOD hates idol worshipping, then why Christians worship the statues of Jesus, Mary, Cross etc…? I agree that many people “who identify themselves as Christians” practice idol worshipping. But that doesn’t mean, Bible allows to worship the statues of Jesus. Nowhere in the Bible it was written that we can worship Jesus in the form of statue. GOD is Spirit and Truth. One who want to worship Him should worship Him in spirit and truth. Christianity should be understood on the basis of Bible, but not on the basis of the acts of Christians. GOD is same yesterday, today and forever. He always hates idol worshipping. If we have a chance to destroy all idols of Jesus, I will be the first person to do it and encourage you as well to do the same. Hope this answers the question.

      Thank you

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    9. Now see how cheap this backdoor technique is. Instead of demonstrating any logic or validity, simply trying to bring back glory glory in a gory gory way. This nonsense has to be put a full stop or a fools stop, dont care either way.

      The useless jealous God should not feel uncomfortable if he even understood what is idol worship. You still have not responded one single syllable on the points raised in the article. Simply desperately hanging on to the Jealous word. I care less if Jehovah is jealous or not. For the entire argument is self defeating.

      Simply promoting the broken ideas when you have no answer, asking a question when no one asked why Jehovah did something is a nice back door. I do not want to tread this back door any long, Prashanth.

      If you can put a full stop and stick to the theme it will be nice, else I do not mind doing some housekeeping on the blog.

      On question of IDOL worship. It is beyond fake people borrowing hindu names to understand what is an IDOL. If you cannot see the IDEAL behind the IDOL, then all I can do is save the pity for such brain dead people for someone worthwhile.

      Any object you are right now conceiving you have a mental picture. The idol is just a prop. Even the worst faker will agree the IDOL is not the IDEAL, but an aid to it. This has been documented scientifically and even the most abstract pure theoretical science expressions agree on that. Of course, I forgot, in your world, which is 6000 years old, it is understood differently.

      This is not a fishing pond for your proselytizing expeditions. If you do not respect that, I do not have any respect for the ones who do not respect boundaries.

      THIS RIDICULOUS BIGOTRY WILL BE LESS HYPOCRITICAL, IF YOU WERE TO GO TO ALL THE CHURCHES IN THE WORLD AND FIRST GET RID OF THE CROSS YOU CLAIM TO BE AGAINST AND ALL THOSE PICTURE PROPS YOU WANT TO GET RID OF. UNLESS IT IS DONE FIRST, I THINK YOU HAVE NOT EVEN THE FAINTEST MORAL AUTHORITY TO TALK OF HINDUISM, JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE A CONVERT AND STILL HAVE A FAKE NAME.

      I ONCE AGAIN WITH RESPECT TELL YOU TO STICK TO THE THEME AND NOT ATTEMPT BACKDOORS TO REINTRODUCE JEHOVISM, WE ARE NOT BUYING IT EVEN IF WE HAVE TO BE IN HELL, DEFINED BY YOU.

      So eternal hell shows his eternal love.. ooops jealousy of not accepting him.. how desperate is his fatal love.

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    10. Dear Brother Satchitananda,

      May GOD bless you and your family. Thanks for your comments. Hope one day you would understand the love I have for you in my heart. Most assuredly I say to you, GOD wants to love each other. There is no doubt in it.

      I did not understand why you think that it was a classic idea stealing when I say “If salt loses its saltiness, it is of no use.” I am actually quoting from Matthew 5:13 –

      “You are the salt of the earth; but if the salt loses its flavor, how shall it be seasoned? It is then good for nothing but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot by men”.

      I did not understand your comment – “This desperate semantic brainwashing, especially after reading Hindu scriptures is really amusing.”

      About 6000 years old earth, it is a big subject and if possible, I will comment some other time.

      About crusades and atrocities committed by “Christians”, I condemn it, I don’t support them and I feel sorry about those incidents. But I want to make it clear one thing, YeShUA did not teach all these things. He only taught LOVE. If possible, I will comment on these things on some other day.

      Yes, I agree that some Christians especially Roman Catholic Church, copy Hinduism. I am not sure about the reasons behind it. That is not good for Christianity. They are actually destroying Christianity. I do not support them.

      I want to say you one thing, if you want to know about Christianity, don’t look at Christians, but look at Christ and His teachings.

      I gave the meaning of YHWH just to make it clear how important is it to have thorough knowledge of Hebrew to understand Bible in correct way.

      Please don’t get offended when I ask some questions. Because you did not mention any Bible verses in your article, I am not sure from where did you get those unbiblical concepts. So I just want to make it sure before responding. I don’t think that I am discussing some irrelevant points. First I discussed about the word YHWH, it was the title of the article. Then asked about the concept of flat earth, this you mentioned in your article and did not provide any references for your claim. Meanwhile, you raised the point about kan-naw’ and another brother also asked a question on it. So I answered that.

      You said that Shabbat is on Sunday. That is also not correct. Shabbat starts on Friday evening and ends on Saturday evening.

      In your article, you mentioned that Jehovah cursed them and all their future unborn progeny, a bunch of curses. This is the original sin and all humans are born with it. It gets transmitted to next generation, irrespective of the human behavior. I don’t know from where did you get this concept. IT WAS COMPLETELY A FALSE STATEMENT AND UNBIBLICAL. I can give you bunch of verses from Bible to prove that you are wrong.

      Matthew 18:3 – Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of Heaven.

      Matthew 19:14 – But YeShUA said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of Heaven.”

      YeShUA taught that little children are without sin and belong to the kingdom of heaven. These were innocent little children and not sinners. And YeShUA did not say that they were sinners and enemies of God, but he said, "of such is the kingdom of Heaven."

      (To be contd)

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    11. @Satchitananda (Contd)

      Ecclesiastes 7:29 – That God made man upright.

      Genesis 1:26 – Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness.

      Genesis 1:27 – So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.

      Job 33:4 – The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.

      Acts 17:28 – For we are also His offspring.

      The Bible says that God has created man good and upright, in his own image and likeness, and without sin. Above verses affirms that God has created man, but also affirms that man is created upright. If man is created upright, he cannot be born a sinner. When God says he has created us "in his image," and has given us "life and breath and all things," are we to understand that he created us as sinners? When he says, "We are his offspring," are we to understand that his offspring are born sinners? The doctrine that men are born sinners is false!

      Deuteronomy 1:39 – Moreover your little ones and your children, who you say will be victims, who today have no knowledge of good and evil, they shall go in there; to them I will give it, and they shall possess it.

      Isaiah 7:15,16 – Curds and honey He shall eat, that He may know to refuse the evil and choose the good. For before the Child shall know to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land that you dread will be forsaken by both her kings.

      Genesis 8:21 – The imagination of man’s heart is evil from his youth

      The Bible teaches that children cannot be sinners and guilty and condemned at birth, for they do not yet know the difference between good and evil, and have not yet come to the "age of accountability". These verses prove that babies are born innocent. Everybody knows that babies know nothing when they are born. They do not know right from wrong. They do not know to refuse the evil, and choose the good. They do not have evil imaginations of the heart. The Bible says that the "imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth," not from his birth. It is only when children know to refuse the evil and choose the good that they can have evil intentions, evil purposes, or evil choices of the heart. Until they know right from wrong, their actions have no moral character, they can do neither good nor evil, and they are innocent before God. The Bible teaches that children must reach the "age of accountability" before they can commit sin.

      Ezekiel 18:20 – The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

      Deuteronomy 24:16 – Fathers shall not be put to death for their children, nor shall children be put to death for their fathers; a person shall be put to death for his own sin.

      The Bible says that man is guilty for his own sins and for his own sins alone. He is not guilty, and cannot be guilty, for the sin of Adam or any other man.

      The Bible teaches that every sin is a free and voluntary act. There is no involuntary sin. Man must will evil and choose evil before he can be a sinner. He cannot be born a sinner, for he has no choice in his birth. The idea that man can be a sinner without a voluntary act of his own will is completely contrary to the Bible. Man must voluntarily choose evil before he can be a sinner.

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    12. Sorry for all these digestions from Hinduism. Very pathetic poor copy. What all you copied, not even one thing is accepted by any Christian Leader.

      I am very much aware of these stealing efforts they have done, be it from Greeks or Pagans (I feel sorry to use that derogatory term popularised by Christians).

      PLEASE STOP SINGING PAEANS TO THE MOST BROKEN ILLOGICAL IDEOLOGY. NOW TOO BUSY INCORPORATING STOLEN IDEAS. You can make a killing if you come to US and share these stolen ideas.

      IF Sinning is not a central theme, then you are saying this Pope is a joker. Please come and tell all your catholic friends what a joke they have been played into. Again it is not any one school, ORIGINAL SIN is a central tenet.

      I would like no more singing glory to Jehovah anymore from you. PLEASE STOP STEALING FROM HINDUISM, ELSE MORE WILL BE EXPOSED NOT OF JEHOVAH, BUT OF THESE CONVERSION ACTIVITIES. FAIR WARNING....

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    13. Dear Sweetly Fake and Patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth) - Here are a few points for you:

      1.) First of being a Christian: you should adopt a name such as Bill Clinton Jr XV or Bush Junior - Jr XXV11 or maybe actually borrow a name from your near abrahamic faith the
      Muslims - Perhaps Saddam Hussein would suit or may be the now absconding Zakir Naik. However I think since you may not want to get *randomly* tested at the airport (damn right ...I want
      majority of Muslims to be checked properly) you may adopt the name Prasanth.

      2.) So Sweetly Fake and Patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth): Do you know why there are two Pilots in a commercial aeroplane? So that if
      one get sucked because of rapture then the other non-christian (and possibly a *sinner* can still fly the plane. ) Now aren't you glad that not all are dirty christians like you?

      3.) Also consider this sweetly fake and patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth): There is INFINITE GAP between Christians and their god - whoever
      the hell that is. This is not so with us the Hindus, so please do not appropriate this theme and idea. You look like a buffoon who has just committed grand larceny right in front of the crowds
      and cops all around. This is what Mr Goldberg did when he tried to do the American Veda thingy but the idiot did not know what to do when asked tough questions.

      Perhaps you do not even know that you are boorish thug who has been pissing in the bowl were gentiles are supposed to wash. Anyway can't blame you when you are low level brazen thief
      who does not have a name from his own faith.

      4.) If you are so dedicated to appropriate all this good stuff of Hinduism, oh Sweetly Fake and Patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth), I welcome
      you back to my Hindu faith. I promise that you will find your own awakening dear sweetly fake and patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth) and there will be
      NO need, I repeat NO NEED for jc to do substitutional atonement for a low life like you. You yourself will be able to uplift yourself...Guranteed!!

      5.) Finally if you really are genuine (which I doubt Sweetly Fake and Patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth)), I suggest that you write to Vatican to have the Statues of Ram Bhagwan ji and Krishna ji in the Sanctum Sanctorum of the Vatican next to jc. Better still if jc will be at the feat of Hanumanji it will be quite good. Now I know what you are thinking low life, but
      if this stunt goes wrong, they will be looking for you. Also note that I have dealt with thieves like you on regular basis. So I know what to do next: Here is my direct email: prabhat.gupta1@gmail.com


      So if you are somewhat decent, just stop being boorish and a buffoon but I guess you don't have to even try. You will thank me....well may be not.
      by friend Prabhat Gupta.

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    15. Satchitananda ji - You have been very civil to this gentile, so please there is no need for any discussion with Sweetly Fake and Patronising Antithesis of a brother (who goes by the stolen Hindu name of Prasanth) as I believe he is a master of cut and paste and really nothing else. jc will, after all, do substitutional atonement for him
      by a friend- Prabhat Gupta.

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    16. Dear Brother Satchitananda,

      May GOD bless you and your family. Hope you are doing good.

      Below is what you mentioned in your writing:
      “Jehovah cursed them and all their future unborn progeny, a bunch of curses. This is the original sin and all humans are born with it. It gets transmitted to next generation, irrespective of the human behavior.”

      I gave you verses from BIBLE to refute your claim. But you say that I copied from hinduism. Ok, fine.

      Please show me from Bible, where it says that GOD cursed all future unborn progeny to become sinners. Where it says that all humans are born with original sin. Where it says that the sin is transmitted from one generation to other irrespective of human behavior.

      Thanks in advance

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    17. Hisss Prasanth the fork toungue is back. May jc do substitutional atonement for you .....you antithesis of a brother.

      So finally you do admit that you are a cheat ({But you say that I copied from hinduism. Ok,fine}I have taken a screen shot of your response, so that in case you try to weasel out....hissss Prasanth, you know that you will look a fool that you really are)

      So hisss Prasanth, May jc do substitutional atonement for you .....you antithesis of a brother you should read this for a start...it is called bible and it is an document that has been rejected by many smart people. Also so that you know hisss Prasanth it originated in a desert and that is why it is bereft of creativity. Now I can recite a mantra and convert you back from hisss Prasant to just Prasanth but if "they" find out (the people who converted you) they will be upset. So you can call me on 9029 38 0062 and I promise nobody will know.

      So for your reference, hisss prasanth, may jc do substitutional atonement for you, you antithesis of brother, read your garbage here:

      Ephesians 2:1–3
      Genesis 8:21
      Proverbs 22:15

      It was developed by some fellow that you may know personally bishop of Lyon (sorry sorry sorry he died long time ago and is in perdition or heaven i do not know). BTW Perdition is also exclusive to christianity because of original sin.

      Also know this hisss Prasanth:

      The sin nature is passed on to us from our fathers and not our mothers

      Sin entered the world through Adam - Romans 5:12 - not Eve who sinned first.
      Heb 7:9-10 has more garbage on this.

      christ who did not have an earthly father did not have original sin passed to him.



      So prasant, will you get the bible amended by writing to pope fellow (the one who has a small skull cap and frequently waves from a balcony somewhere in vatican) and who also canonized a woman who preyed upon to meek, elderly and destitute. ....but that is a different topic.

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    18. Dear Brother Prabhat Gupta,

      May GOD bless you and your family.

      It looks like you misunderstood me. This is what I said, “I gave you verses from BIBLE to refute your claim. But you say that I copied from hinduism. Ok, fine”.

      If you still believe that I copied from hinduism, please help me to understand which of the Bible verses I copied from hinduism.

      Thanks for bringing up few verses from Bible. Let’s examine them if they speak anything about so called “Original Sin”. Below are the things we are trying to review:

      1. Does Bible say that GOD cursed all future unborn progeny to become sinners?

      2. Does Bible say that all humans are born with original sin?

      3. Does Bible say that the sin is transmitted from one generation to other irrespective of human behavior?

      Scripture# 1: Ephesians 2:1-3, And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

      Here, Paul is writing to newly converted Christians in Ephesus. He is saying to them that, before their conversion, they had lived in trespasses and sins, and walked in every kind of wickedness, in company with other sinners, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind and were by nature (past wicked works done by them) the children of wrath even as others.

      Scripture# 2: Genesis 8:21, And the LORD smelled a soothing aroma. Then the LORD said in His heart, “I will never again curse the ground for man’s sake, although the imagination of man’s heart is evil from his youth; nor will I again destroy every living thing as I have done.

      The context of this verse is after global flood during Noah’s time. The curse mentioned here is the flood. It is nowhere related to so called “original sin”. Moreover, you can see in this verse, that the imagination of man’s heart is evil from his youth. Not from birth.

      Scripture# 3: Proverbs 22:15, Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; The rod of correction will drive it far from him.

      This verse is not at all related to sin. This proverb is about disciplining or correcting a child.

      Scripture# 4: Romans 5:12, Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned.

      This verse clearly says that, death spread to all men because all sinned. This doesn’t say that sin was transferred from one to another. A person becomes a sinner when he commits a sin voluntarily by his own choice. Bible says that both man and woman are of one flesh (Echad). Adam, as the leader of the family, was held responsible, not only for his own sin, but also because he did not provide adequate protection for his wife, allowing her to sin.

      Scripture# 5: Hebrews 7:9-10, Even Levi, who receives tithes, paid tithes through Abraham, so to speak, for he was still in the loins of his father when Melchizedek met him.

      This verse says nothing about sin. Here Paul is talking about Melchizedek, a type of Christ and forerunner of Jesus.

      Conclusion: No, GOD did not curse all future unborn progeny to become sinners. Humans are not born with original sin. Sin is not transmitted from one generation to other irrespective of human behavior.

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    20. Dear Fake brother with a Hindu Name - Get this in your head.No matter of fibbing will make a low life convert escape perdition.

      As a matter of fact jc is now in hell because all his followers who converted "heathens" to xianity, did so by cheating. jc is depressed and is offereing seva to Hanuman ji.

      Secondly I do not need you nor your god's wishes to bless me and my family. My parents, well-wishers on this forum as well my Gurus are enough to look after me.

      Thirdly, after cleaning toilets of the white man, you may have become a bit smart. ......but you still smell. So get that neshama and other B$ out of your head and become a Hindu again. Once you do that I will need not to tell you what has been copied lock, stock and barrel by you and your lot of swines. You will be able to figure pretty much own your own.


      Prabhat Gupta - Not your brother, never was ...never will be.

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  11. Dear fake-brother Prashant

    It is clear, you are here to attempt and scuttle the intellectual thinking and challenge it. You don't call it a debate to lull others from vigorously challenging you. You call it questioning , when you are actually debating that the author doesn't know your worldview -- a sign of intellectual dishonesty to cover your tracks of aggression as you go along. He doesn't have to know your worldview. He has his own worldview and framework, ethics and philosophy to judge you and your god by your actions and ideas. You have to know his worldview and in his worldview, he is calling out folks like you.

    You may 'believe' your genocidal god Yaweh/Jehovah is loving. Capitalizing it a thousand times simply highlights his/your pompousness, pettiness and aggression.

    It doesn't matter how much you 'smile' using language, since we are no longer the fools who are taken in by empty gestures followed by assault. We don't have to believe that ur genocidal maniac god is loving. History has stood testimony to his deluded direct incitement for carnage.

    Sanctified(by you? or self-sanctified! auto-sanctified! ) jealousy is just a hypocritical term for over possessiveness and encroachment. As per Sanatana Dharma, coveting is the crime that destroys the union with the atman and if ur diety Jehovah covets he is not a god but a mere asura in internal character, as per Sanatana Dharma. So your clarification about the nature of his jealous trip, just brings out clearer that he is an asura in the mind, fighting against the religious freedom of the people in the world.

    Also the author above is not interested in 'educating' you about your christian interpretation, since your arbitrary interpretations is not about being scientific or truthful but ad hoc ideology, and could be as colorful as any lie . He is interested in educating you about the Hindu view of your activities, such as false interpretations, intellectual theft and corrections to pander for converts.

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  12. Informative article. Here in India those converts & Benny Hin kinds abuse Hindus telling they worship stones. I don't know then what the Jesus statue is made up of. So in this also they are flawed.

    They praise the glory of 'lord' but just because they praise I am unable to understand why they should be let off from their sins and from their original sins.

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  13. Thanks for the focus JRKji and Omkarji.

    My sincere request to all readers is to keep the discussion going on multiple platforms. Take it to those who are in danger of getting converted by the deep pocketed tricky proselytizers. Erect a defense of logic to protect Dharma.

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  14. What is the purpose of articles like this one? Stop conversions? Let common people understand true nature of Christianity? Educate the targets of conversion so that they will make educated decisions? Or another high sounding intellectual exercise confined to the eggheads? If we want to bring out the intellectual, moral ethical and historical inaccuracies of Bible which are many, that is a good exercise. There are many books and youtube clips even by atheists like Sam Harris and Bill Mahr. I have a dozen books like the one by Bertrand Russell " why I am not a Christian" and a book called " The Encyclopedia of Biblical Errancies" by Mckinsey. We need short articles of 300 to 400 words in simple English and translated into all Indian languages and put on social media. This will help people to understand the true nature of Christianity. Discussions between so called IKs is not going to help stop the tide of conversions.

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    1. Good suggestion. Short brief pointers that can be disseminated quickly.

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  15. @Prashanth - Dhanyawaad for your lengthy answer. You seem to be a professional.

    Your answer reminds me of a strategy which Church have been following since beginning. It's called Good Cop - Bad Cop Strategy. And you seem to be a Good Cop. You might not even know that. Most apologists don't.

    I guess you are aware that this jealousy gid thing resulted in the genocide of 50 - 60 lakh Jews. Now you are simply saying that it was mistranslated

    I don't understand how god allowed this mis understanding, especially when it lead to almost wiping out Jews from the face of earth. Why is he so incompetent? How can some one so incompetent can be god. How can he be a god , if he simply makes a book go around the world propagating that he ia the only god and those who don't subscribe to this will be burnt in hell for eternity, while showing no evidence what so ever?

    What is the diff btw your concept of god and some one who threatens a female that if she don't love him, he will throw acid on her face

    How can god burn ppl in hell for eternity just because they didn't convert, without even showing any evidence?

    Forget about god, not even a normal human being can be as sadistic

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    1. I hope the response will not be another hallelujah round, which I am not going to encourage. So far no responses to the questions raised. Only more quotes and attempts to disseminate Bible.

      One can go and attack on Science angles like Sam Harris. How come God took six days to create the universe? Where is the remotest proof that world is only 6000 years old? They wiggle out calling it misinterpretation.

      Ask about the trickery and show they deploy to bring more gullible into their fold, they again wiggle out claiming not all do it. Show them proof that they are copying every aspect of Hinduism in South Indian Churches, pat comes the response, we all dont do it. Then ask them to go and condemn those fakers.

      Yatha raja thatha praja... Like Jehovah so are the followers..

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    2. Dear Brother Ranjith,

      May GOD bless you and your family. Hope you are doing good.

      It seems you have a misconception that Bible teaches something like this - All Christians will go to heaven and all non-Christians will go to hell.

      That is completely wrong. Bible never teaches like that.

      Let me give you one specific reference,
      For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” – Galatians 5:14

      If you are neither a Jew nor a Christian, or never heard of the gospel of YeShUA Ha’MaShiYaCh or do not understand it, then love for others is sufficient to keep you out of hell.

      Will all Christians go to heaven? NO

      A person will not become a Christian just by taking birth in a Christian family or by taking some money and “convert” to Christianity. In John 3:3, YeShUA clearly says that unless one is “born again”, he cannot see the kingdom of God. In sixth verse, he further explains, that which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Bible says that every person should “convert”, including “self labelled Christians”. Real meaning of conversion is to born again - “Death in flesh and born again in Spirit”.

      About Jews – don’t worry, they will never be wiped out from the face of the earth. In Leviticus 26:44, GOD promised that He would never allow the people of Israel to be completely destroyed. This we can see throughout history. Many times they went into exiles, many times they were expelled, many tried to completely destroy them. But they are not completely destroyed. They suffered not because GOD is incompetent, neither any mistranslation nor misunderstanding is the cause for their sufferings, they are responsible for whatever they had. If you read TaNaKh, you can find many prophesies foretold about these things.

      I would like to re-emphasize that the word jealous does not always have negative meaning in Hebrew. I already gave you how different spellings were used in Hebrew, for the same word when used in different context. Even the English word jealous derived from Zealous have different meanings. Mosheh wrote TORAH approximately 3500 years ago in ancient Hebrew (not even in modern Hebrew). My sincere request is that when you apply modern English translations to ancient Hebrew words, before you come to a conclusion, try to understand the context and original meaning in root language.

      Thank you

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    3. Hi Ranjith - Please allow me to kill the serpent.
      You may have yet another chance.

      Thanks,

      Prabhat Gupta
      ==================================================

      Ooooh la la la la oooh.

      Hisss is back.....welcome back from christian heaven or was it muslim heaven where you had 72 virgins? Sorry you are a christian i now know.

      So why have you not responded to my questions Hisss?

      Is it because

      a.) You are tired.
      b.) You do not know.
      c.) Your bag of bull$hit is empty.
      d.) All of the above.


      Now may jc do substitutional atonement for you here are my responses, some comments and some questions which have the answers built into them.

      1.) Why do christians want to convert?
      2.) Will all non christians, Hindus therefore included, will go to hell?
      3.) Why is there a perdition? What happens there?

      When you answer make sure that you let us know whether it is your view or vatican's view. I know how you will weasel and wriggle out of this ...but I want others to see it any way. This is what Francis Clooney did and around 15 other "good christians" did.

      Now you have indicated to Shreepal ji that you were born in India and hence kept an Indian name. So similarly you should have kept your Hindu Dharma as well as you were born in India as Hindu Dharma emerged and evolved in India and is the greatest gift too the world and I can understand why straw men like you would want to appropriate the philosophies of it.

      Moral: Do not be weasel. Actually the likes of you are already weasel so no point telling it to you.

      If you think you will be buried next to white man, think again. Why do you think the churches are segregated on the basis of race?

      I know how you have been trained....here it is:

      http://www.desicontrarian.com/the-christian-caste-system/

      http://www.clergyproject.org/

      http://www.bartdehrman.com/

      http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/

      http://wiki.ironchariots.org/index.php?title=Main_Page

      http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rationaldoubt/

      http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rationaldoubt/2015/08/evangelical-hate-speech-in-the-name-of-love/

      Hindus on this forum are not prepared to believe even for a moment that the organisation that you represent which is astute in the subtleties of argument and as mischievous in the creation of narratives, of false premise will choose stooges like you to wage a ideological war. The church knows that when they choose a hisss like you, they know the implications of choosing someone like you: Dis ingenuousness and Dishonesty is inherent in that choice which can be disguised as scholarship for the unread and naive. So if you are hoping for naive people to be found here....you will go empty handed. May jc do substitutional atonement for you.

      Also read this and ask you pope papa to read this as well:

      and yes this:

      http://www.truthbeknown.com/victims.htm

      Do get you papa pope to apologise, will you? I will not hold my breath.


      So hisss you tried hard but it ain't going to work for you ain't even a doubting thomas. You ain't even a judas. May be if you tried hard like Michael Jackson you will become white (but wait he did not get buried in a white cemetery).

      So keep trying to dodge the issue. May jc do substitutional atonement for you. People here have rattled your cage.....Jackpot.

      See if you can get pope to help you.

      Fake brother hisss Prasnath, do respond back.

      Prabhat Gupta

      Delete
    4. @Prashanth

      Please stop fooling around. Not any more. Love your neighbour applies to only fellow believers who believe in the so called one true god and not Hindus who are infidels and heathens. Only based on this nonsense Christianity destroyed so many native civilizations and killed crores of people and took the world back to stone ages. Thanks to reformation, Church - government separation in Europe. Had it not been the case, the world would have been still where it was in 15 - 1600s as penicillin, computer, internet mobile phone would have been blasphemy.

      I hope not just Good cops like you, even the Chruch also take the stance you are taking on Hell and Heven. But unfortunately it will not in the near future.

      Here are those nonsense lines from your Bible which say that non believers go to hell and believers go to heaven

      Mark 16: 15

      And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

      Mark 16: 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

      Now please stop this nonsense.

      @Prabhath ji - I dont think our Good Cop Prasanth is going to come back...... :)

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    5. @Prashanth - However silly, illogical and irrational it may be is but still let us for the moment say that those who never heard of gospel are exempt from hell. Then why the hell do you need to tell this gospel to every one as without knowing about it is the best thing that happen to the humanity as they will be exempted from the hell

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  16. My dear Prasantha, I have a question for you but of a totally different kind. You are not a Hindu; you are a Christian. There is nothing wrong with it. What is wrong is this: Prasantha is a Hindu name and you have nothing to do Hinduism. What is the purpose of using a name that does not belong to you? Is it not to deceive Hindus, by putting a color/name pretending that you belong to them? Is this what Jesus Christ has taught to you? Cheating and deceiving others by faking identity? Like you is at least one more that I know of: Mihir Sharma. Why, why you people treading a path of immorality of deceit? Is it a Christian strategy? Please reply.

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    1. Dear Brother Shreepal Singh,

      May GOD bless you and your family. In your question, I see the words “deceive”, “pretend”, “cheating”, “faking identity” and “strategy”. It seems you completely misunderstood me. I request you to think yourself honestly, is it possible for me to deceive or cheat people in this platform just by pretending or by faking my identity? You will definitely know that I am a Christian by looking at my comments, then how can I deceive you by faking my identity? What benefit would I get from this?

      NO; I am not pretending nor faking my identity. I have no intentions to deceive you nor cheat you. Myself and my parents are Telugu speaking people. In Telugu, my name “Prasanth” means “Great Peace”. I hope you already knew this meaning. My parents might have found that this is a very good word with a very good meaning and so they called me with this name.

      I am not an evangelist nor a proselytizer. I am a normal person work for a private IT company. I have lot of Hindu friends since my childhood. My school friends, college friends, colleagues and neighbor’s, all are Hindus. None of them had any problem with me. So, I believe that you too can treat me as your friend. I have no intentions to convert you into Christianity and I don’t even expect that would happen. In fact, I know that you will not receive my comments in a positive way and curse me for my comments. That is the reason, I always start with a blessing (In Matthew 5:44, YeShUA said, “Bless those who curse you”). So, there is no question of implementing a “strategy” and “deceiving”.

      My roommate, he is a Hindu and great fan of Rajiv Malhotra, shared me this blog and said to me, “want you to update below post with your comments as per your knowledge”. When I read this blog, I had a feeling that you guys had lot of misconceptions about Christianity which you might have built by looking at “Christians”. Whatever you perceive by looking at Christians, is not actually true Christianity. There are lot of misconceptions and false doctrines. I use to identify myself as a Catholic since my childhood and till I was 19 years old. Then I started realizing that many teachings of Catholicism are unbiblical and so, I left it forever. Now, I say that I am a Christian and I don’t identify myself with any of the denominations. If anybody tells me anything which is according to Bible, I will accept it, otherwise I will reject it. I am telling all these things so that you would understand me and don’t think that I am cheating you.

      Regarding my name, you may have your own opinion, but I don’t agree with it. Basically names cannot be attributed to a religion. They don’t have a religion. They are words of a language and they do have meanings according to its language. Names that are found in Bible should not be treated as “Christian” names, but they are “Hebrew” names. They have specific meaning in Hebrew. Example, Adam means “man”, Noah means “comfort”, David means “beloved one”. Names like Bill Clinton, George Bush, Xavier has nothing to do with Christianity. You don’t find these names in Bible. They might be European or American names. If your logic is correct, you should ask Americans and Europeans to adopt Hebrew names. I do agree with you to some extent that some names like Rama, Krishna can be treated as Hindu names because they are prominent deities of Hinduism. But you cannot say that all Indian names are Hindu names. In India we do have Sanskrit names, Hindi names, Tamil names, Malayali names, Punjabi names, Bengali names, Assamese names, Manipuri names etc. We should not mix religion with ethnicity, nationality and politics. Having relationship with GOD is a personal matter related to spirituality. My ethnicity and nationality has nothing to do with it.

      While Americans have American names, why is it wrong for a Telugu person to have a Telugu name? Why should I adopt an American name? I believe that my name is a Telugu name, I love my name and I don’t think that I should change the name which was given to me by my parents.

      Delete
  17. My dear Prasantha, I have a question for you but of a totally different kind. You are not a Hindu; you are a Christian. There is nothing wrong with it. What is wrong is this: Prasantha is a Hindu name and you have nothing to do Hinduism. What is the purpose of using a name that does not belong to you? Is it not to deceive Hindus, by putting a color/name pretending that you belong to them? Is this what Jesus Christ has taught to you? Cheating and deceiving others by faking identity? Like you is at least one more that I know of: Mihir Sharma. Why, why you people treading a path of immorality of deceit? Is it a Christian strategy? Please reply.

    ReplyDelete
  18. While some people will undoubtedly be up in arms over this, we should look at what other “religious beliefs” could exempt students from some classes. For example:
    • For a long time Christians opposed the concept of infinity. Only God was infinite, yet one cannot imagine modern mathematics without it.
    • According to Christian thought, vacuums couldn’t exist because God was everywhere. How could electronics have developed without vacuum tubes?
    • Christians accepted the idea that world was flat because the Bible says it is. Now imagine teaching Geography that way.
    • The Bible is clear that the world is about 6,000 years old. Yet one cannot teach meaningful geology without shattering this notion,
    • The book of Genesis tells us explicitly that humans are a separate creation yet biology makes no sense if that were true.
    • The bible clearly states many times that the Earth does not move but Astronomy tells us that it does.
    Let us see what Hindu scriptures say:
    • Infinity was accepted in Hindu scriptures for a very long time.
    • Vacuum was known to Hindus as “Sunya”
    • In both Mahabharatam and Bhagavatam, earth is described as spherical. The whole universe is modelled as Brhamandam. A Great Egg.
    • The age of the Earth is 1.92 billion years closer to the modern estimate of 4.6 billion years.
    • Avatars of Vishnu Matsya (Fish), Koorma (Turtle), Varaha (Boar), Narsimha(Halflion half human), Vamana, Parasuraama, Raama, Krishna suggest some sort of evolution
    • Here Hindus thought earth was the centre of the universe.
    Not bad 5/6 compared to 0/6 for Bible.

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  19. Some persons aiming at the highest political office in the US (Trump and tribe) have suggested for a "Sharia Test" to judge whether a Muslim should be or should not be allowed immigration to that country arguing that "Sharia doctrines are incompatible with democracy". Well argued. Please Christians, take a step further: "Bible's doctrines are incompatible with science - biology, geology, astronomy, mathematics, electronics and many more branches". Please apply the test of "incompatibility" to Christians for being "admitted to schools and colleges" also so that either the Christians change their views or schools / colleges are closed (!). What do you say, dear Prasant?

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  20. Some persons aiming at the highest political office in the US (Trump and tribe) have suggested for a "Sharia Test" to judge whether a Muslim should be or should not be allowed immigration to that country arguing that "Sharia doctrines are incompatible with democracy". Well argued. Please Christians, take a step further: "Bible's doctrines are incompatible with science - biology, geology, astronomy, mathematics, electronics and many more branches". Please apply the test of "incompatibility" to Christians for being "admitted to schools and colleges" also so that either the Christians change their views or schools / colleges are closed (!). What do you say, dear Prasant?

    ReplyDelete
  21. (1)My dearest Prasanth,

    You invoked God to bless me and my family and it is so nice of you. Why me and my family alone, let God bless the whole humanity! Because God is compassionate to all, even to insects, who have no religion and none of their saviors to save them from hell! Let me assure you, I have nothing against you. Why should I be against you? My use of the words like “deceive”, “pretend”, “cheating”, “faking identity” and “strategy” etc. are directed against them who ‘try to unsuspectingly approach innocent people who dot belong to Christian religion, nor would like to become one if ‘directly and plainly’ approached by a person having the sole motive and mission to bring such ‘unsuspecting ones’ to Christianity. Do you include yourself in that group of Christian? If you include yourself in that one, then certainly you ‘deceive’, ‘cheat’ … etc. Why? You know, when lion approaches its prey, it uses ‘stealth’ and suddenly pounces upon it before the prey is able to understand anything! And, that is the end-game of the innocent. Is it not so, dear Prasanth? Prasanth is a lovely name and you have every right on Earth to use it to your heart’s content. But, in India it works as ‘stealth’ for the unsuspecting Hindus. Is it not so, Prasanth? And, please be aware, it is not me, when I used these unpalatable words that you may be seeking to ‘deceive’ me; it is the millions of uneducated, innocent, unsuspecting Hindus that I had meant.
    Please believe me I have nothing against Jesus Christ or millions or billions of persons who are following him. Please visit https://indianpeoplescongress.wordpress.com/lord-jesus-christ/ what I stand for. What I am against to is this: You are entirely wrong in putting all your energy and time in ‘Spreading the Good Word’. You got Christ wrong in that. He said millions of things and you pick-up one of them and make it a mission of your life! Every great Saint or spiritual person in history wished that spiritual knowledge should reach to everyone; For example, Lord Buddha also said that spread the spiritual message; in fact, his first five disciples were directed by Buddha in all directions!

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  22. (2) Dear Prasanth,
    What I am against to is this: Please treat a book as a book only! Be it holy or otherwise. It is all hearsay; hearsay of those who heard him. Do you know a scientific experiment was conducted about how the ‘facts’ are distorted when they pass from one hand to another hand? Facts are really distorted when they pass from hand to hand. Or, you don’t believe in science and its experiments? If it is so, then it is unfortunate (for you)! Yes, Jesus Christ realized the Supreme Being, call it God or whatever. There have been millions of them who had/have similarly realized that Supreme Being.
    What I am against to is this: It is hearsay to claim that one can reach God only through one person – Christ. I implore you, please be a rational person! Can’t you see the folly of this claim when you are put a question: What will happen to those who lived and died before Christ was born? Please reflect on this: How mean a God would be to animals, trees (do you believe three are living beings?), insects, birds etc. when He ordains that none will be saved unless he comes to the refuge of Christ? Is God not omnipresent, I mean was He not there when Christ was not yet born? What had happened to those unfortunate people – for no fault of theirs – who lived long back before Christ, say people of Rakhigarhi or Bhirrana who lived 9000 years ago? Buddha never claimed any such exclusive position. Was Buddha a fool? Or, the book is wiser than Buddha in claiming so? I expect you to reflect on all these things, before being persistent on your position.

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  23. (3) Dear Prasanth,
    You are a nice person and I never misunderstood you, completely or otherwise. You have school friends who are/were Hindus and nobody has any problem with you; it is really nice and we all should be like this. I assure you, I receive your comments in a positive way and we are discussing issues. I understand that you are guided by reason; and, if you say otherwise, then, yes, I misunderstood you.

    Your name is beautiful and has a wonderful meaning! No doubt about that. All the more, it looks more appealing to us Indians when we find it is derived from Sanskrit, an ancient Indian language. Please rest assured, I have not an iota of intention to shake your belief in Jesus Christ! Do whatever you can do reach your God; but do not make it a business – with all the trappings of a mundane business – of your life to recruit others because they have their own God to take them in His lap! Never, ever, say that they all will go to eternal hellfire who do not join the army of your faith. Is it not reasonable enough to demand from you, dear Prasanth?

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    1. (1)Dear Brother Shreepal Singh,

      May GOD bless you and your family. You raised several important points. Let me try to touch few of them. You may have a different opinion, but please consider this as a Christian point of view.

      Point 1: Please treat a book as a book only! 'Facts' are distorted when they pass from one hand to another hand.

      I agree with you that in general, the facts will be distorted when they pass from one hand to another hand. But here the false notion is, many assume that each new translation of the Bible being a revision of, or based on the immediate previous translation. That was a wrong assumption. Every new version is a completely new translation of the Holy Bible made by over a hundred scholars working directly from the "best available" Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek texts. The most modern translations use the much older manuscripts.

      The Dead Sea Scrolls(Qumran cave scrolls) are perhaps the greatest archaeological find of our time. The Dead Sea Scrolls contain at least fragments of every book in the Old Testament except the book of Esther. More than ten scrolls were beautifully preserved intact including two copies of Isaiah. These copies of Isaiah, written around 2nd century BC have proven to be “word for word identical” with our standard Hebrew Bible in more than 95 percent of the text. The five percent of variation consisted chiefly of obvious slips of the pen and variations in spelling. Prior to the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, our oldest text of the Hebrew Old Testament (Masoretic text) came from about 1000 AD. Dead sea scrolls were 1200 years older (dated back to 250 BC). If texts were distorted as they are copied, as many assume, 1200 years would be enough time to observe considerable changing in the text. But, that did not happen. Many of the biblical books found at Qumran are virtually no different from the standard Hebrew text dating from much later. The change is very little and insignificant. There is a reason for so little change. As a matter of quality control, the scribes who copied texts counted the letters in each line after copying it. They made a mark under the middle letter. They checked to see if the mid-point mark was under the same letter in the original text from which the copy was made. If not, they knew there was a mistake, and they began again.

      The Septuagint, or LXX, is the oldest Greek translation of the Old Testament. It was begun around 247 BC by seventy scholars in Alexandria, Egypt and was completed no later than 117 BC. The Septuagint was also most likely the standard Old Testament text used by the early Christian church.

      There are over 6,000 early manuscript copies of the Greek New Testament in existence today. When we include the Latin Vulgate and other early versions, we have over 24,000 early copies of the New Testament. Some of these date only twenty to thirty years from the original autographs. There is such a large amount of early manuscript evidence and such a concordance between those manuscripts that we can reconstruct the Bible and be certain of about 95% of the original content. No doctrine of the Bible is in danger of loss by any of the variations.

      Bible is not just a book. It is a library of books or collection of books. After a careful study of all these books, one would discover that Bible is an integrated messaging system. The message was distributed across different books, even though it was a compilation of 66 books penned by more than 40 different authors, who even don’t know each other, over a period of more than 1500 years (Moshe wrote first book around 1500 BC while Yochanan wrote final book around 95 AD), it demonstrates an integrity of design in every detail, every place name, the subtleties of the text, all testify to its singular authorship. The New Testament is in the Old Testament concealed; The Old Testament is in the New Testament revealed.

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    2. (2)Dear Brother Shreepal Singh,

      Point 2: Jesus Christ realized the Supreme Being, call it God or whatever. There have been millions of them who had/have similarly realized that Supreme Being. What will happen to those who lived and died before Christ was born? Is God not omnipresent, I mean was He not there when Christ was not yet born?

      As a Christian, I don’t agree with your statement that Jesus Christ realized the Supreme Being. This is what Bible taught me:
      “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us.” – John 1

      “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist” – Colossians 1:15-17

      About 2000 years ago, He became flesh and dwelt among us. But He is there from the beginning.

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    3. (3)Dear Brother Shreepal Singh,

      Point 3: How mean a God would be to animals, trees (do you believe three are living beings?), insects, birds etc. when He ordains that none will be saved unless he comes to the refuge of Christ?

      I agree that the animals, trees, insects, birds etc. are living beings.

      But they don’t need salvation. Because they don’t have a soul that lives after death.

      All living things have a “nefesh” – the life force, the instinctual. This is driven by “instinct” and is responsible for emotional responses such as love, fear, memory, intelligence etc. But there exists in humans another entity that is very different and much higher. This is called “neshama” and only this has the ability to have a relationship with GOD, transcendent dimension of existence. This is where humans enter the unique realm of making free will moral decisions.

      Creation of man is unique among all of GOD’s creations. Bible teaches us that human soul came directly from GOD’s innermost “Essence”. The rest of creation, on the other hand, was created with speech and emanates from GOD’s Power but not from His Essence. This we can understand from Genesis 2:7 – “And YHWH God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life (neshamat Chaim); and man became a living being (nefesh Chaya).”

      The measure of true humanity is the degree that one controls his “nefesh”, because otherwise a person is acting like an animal. Actually, he is worse than an animal. Wasting spiritual potential is something that only a human is held accountable for. Neshama which came directly from GOD’s innermost Essence, is completely independent of any physical substance. For a human being, when the body expires, neshama lives on eternally. Whereas since animals lack a neshama, when the body expires, their nefesh expires, too.

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    4. 5 Dec 2016

      Dear Fake brother with neshama - No response from you! Busy cleaning the toilets of Salvation Army??!!

      So looks like your GODFATHER (obviously) with neshama is not coaching you. Not to worry, keep cleaning the toilets and you shall be promoted to a higher neshama.

      Anyway I am looking for fools like you and as a matter of fact I have caught him on the act using my mobile phone (without neshama). He was so embarrassed and fearful that he has left the area and hiding in a different city (i think). All I told him was " Can I show this to your Cardinal as well later on post it on facebook / youtube) for Pope to see" He was teary eyed and nervous and I recorded that too.

      So fake brother with a Hindu name and neshama....please become a Hindu again and you will not be as fearful as that fool whose video is with me.

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  24. Hisss Hisss Hisss... Lucifer welcome back.From what the fake brother Prasanth (with a stolen Hindu name) has written, he seems to be a highly evolved animal with neshama.....but but but for bible and it's followers there is no evolution (or is there an evolution oh hisss fake brother with a stolen Hindu name Prasanth with neshama?)

    Anyway you are the brown skinned boy (like me) living a white man's religion with the hope that you will buried next to them (unlike me who will be cremated). The best that can happen to you, slave boy, after writing all this, that too I am sure with a lot of coaching from your white masters is that you instead of cleaning their toilets you will now be elevated to the level of packer / cleaner in the back rooms of Salvation Army. I see boys like you daily, toiling, with a "happy jesus" T shirt and packing stuff. So good luck pedaling yet another piece of bull$hit. I am sure jc will do substitutional atonement for a snake like you with neshama.

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    1. Also next time make sure that you do not take so much time to respond, it only makes you look like a animal with neshama. Also let me know the name of your masters and may be I will have you freed from their bondage.

      This idea that bible is integrated collection of books is basically stolen. Let the person, with a skull cap, who sits in vatican, called i think popa or pope or something like that say so. He will be expelled for hearsay and then heresy. Know the difference slave boy Prasanth (with a stolen HINDU name) between hearsay and heresy??!!

      Mentioning qumran, isaiah, masoretic text etc makes you look like a buffoon who has plagiarised the whole text. But then not your fault, you lack the neshama. Understand that slave boy and you will be alright.....but you will not get buried next to a white man and be packing their used clothes for a long long time. If you want to get freed you know where to get me and I will utter a small mantra and you will then turn into a Hindu Human instead of a snake with neshama.

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